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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:25 pm 
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Cool, and this renews my thinking that sours are the new "it" thing. First it was double IPAs, then barrel aged everything, now it's wild/sour fermentation.

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:29 pm 
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The latest batch from the closet was a saison at about 6.6%. It is good, maybe even "other people would like it" good. And it's going fucking fast... I can't stop drinking it. I will have to brew two batches at once to fix the supply issue I am creating by drinking 4 or 5 of these a day on the weekends and 2 or 3 a night during the week. But it's nicely balanced, finishes sweet (I used a little bit of flaked maize in a nod to Spotted Cow and it worked nicely), the yeast is incredibly good with cloves and black pepper flavors, and something in the malt bill even has a little hint of "barnyard" when the glass warms up over 50 degrees. Like, hay and grass, not horse ass. For a first guess, this was pretty good. Really not sure what I'll tweak. I NEED other people to drink some so I get real feedback... because I dig it, and am just about guzzling it, but I have no perspective.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 1:49 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Cool, and this renews my thinking that sours are the new "it" thing. First it was double IPAs, then barrel aged everything, now it's wild/sour fermentation.


As much as I wish you were correct, I don't think it's true at all. Maybe 20% of the places I've been that have at least 15 or so craft beers on tap have had a single sour/wild ale on tap. And how many decent U.S. breweries even make one? Maybe there's some growth in recent years but it's from an extremely small base. At least in CA, DIPAs never stopped being the "it" thing.


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 1:59 pm 
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billy g Wrote:
Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Cool, and this renews my thinking that sours are the new "it" thing. First it was double IPAs, then barrel aged everything, now it's wild/sour fermentation.


As much as I wish you were correct, I don't think it's true at all. Maybe 20% of the places I've been that have at least 15 or so craft beers on tap have had a single sour/wild ale on tap. And how many decent U.S. breweries even make one? Maybe there's some growth in recent years but it's from an extremely small base. At least in CA, DIPAs never stopped being the "it" thing.


As far as DIPAs go, you're tainted by your location. You always had them, but most of the rest of the world didn't, and now they're all over the damned place. As for sours, I am seeing them crop up at more of the top-shelf places, and while I don't think they'll get Ubiquitous, they'll spread a good bit. You will see more than west coasters and belgians making these, mark my words. It's the new thing to do to distinguish yourself as being ahead of the curve. I got a feelin...

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 2:25 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
billy g Wrote:
Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Cool, and this renews my thinking that sours are the new "it" thing. First it was double IPAs, then barrel aged everything, now it's wild/sour fermentation.


As much as I wish you were correct, I don't think it's true at all. Maybe 20% of the places I've been that have at least 15 or so craft beers on tap have had a single sour/wild ale on tap. And how many decent U.S. breweries even make one? Maybe there's some growth in recent years but it's from an extremely small base. At least in CA, DIPAs never stopped being the "it" thing.


As far as DIPAs go, you're tainted by your location. You always had them, but most of the rest of the world didn't, and now they're all over the damned place. As for sours, I am seeing them crop up at more of the top-shelf places, and while I don't think they'll get Ubiquitous, they'll spread a good bit. You will see more than west coasters and belgians making these, mark my words. It's the new thing to do to distinguish yourself as being ahead of the curve. I got a feelin...


I still disagree. More people will dabble in them, sure, but I don't ever see it becoming much more than a fringe beer. Not enough people have the palate for them and they are damn hard to make. I think its more likely that you'll find a few more breweries specializing in them than it becoming a beer that every brewery makes like the DIPA. I don't think its something you dabble in. It takes a commitment to do them right. There are plenty of other things breweries can do to distinguish themselves that seem much easier like single hop expressions, strange flavor additives for special releases (The Bruery just made a beer that has Thai Iced Tea in it), civet poop or bull testicle beers, or innovative barrel programs (there are a lot more barrels out there than just bourbon barrels. Has anyone aged a beer in a sherry cask? I recently found a Mikkeler beer aged in a sauterne cask but I don't think I've ever seen another one like that.)

That said, I hope I am wrong. They are my favorite beer style and they are not that easy to find even in CA. By contrast, DIPAs/IPAs are made by everyone and most craft beer bars still dedicate 25-40% of their taps to DIPAs/IPAs.


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 2:36 pm 
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I do not think they'll ever get as common as DIPAs are now. No way, for all the reasons you mentioned. But I say they're going to be made by at least one or two guys in all the big beer centers - WI/MI, New England, NC, Colorado, etc. Right now that's not happening. It just seems like the sort of thing the upper crust nano guys will be chasing as a line-in-the-sand product, saying "we're serious, and here's how we prove it." There's not much left right now for them to do that a bunch of mid-level guys with 8-state distributions aren't also doing. Oh you make a quadrupel? Awesome, so does Smuttynose, Sam Adams, and Harpoon. I'm telling you, these guys chase status.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:22 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
But I say they're going to be made by at least one or two guys in all the big beer centers - WI/MI, New England, NC, Colorado, etc. Right now that's not happening. It just seems like the sort of thing the upper crust nano guys will be chasing as a line-in-the-sand product, saying "we're serious, and here's how we prove it."


Aren't we already there though? That's not a high bar to pass. I have in my refrig at home sour ales from utah, michigan, oklahoma, oregon, maryland and texas in addition to CA and Belgium.


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:29 pm 
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Shit, I didn't know that many places were already in on it. I guess we might be.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:37 pm 
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Is there a truly great sour/wild ale that is available on a macro level?

Like the quad equivalent of the St. Bernardus Abt 12?


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:38 pm 
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Duchess would qualify, right?

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:10 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
I do not think they'll ever get as common as DIPAs are now. No way, for all the reasons you mentioned. But I say they're going to be made by at least one or two guys in all the big beer centers - WI/MI, New England, NC, Colorado, etc. Right now that's not happening. It just seems like the sort of thing the upper crust nano guys will be chasing as a line-in-the-sand product, saying "we're serious, and here's how we prove it." There's not much left right now for them to do that a bunch of mid-level guys with 8-state distributions aren't also doing. Oh you make a quadrupel? Awesome, so does Smuttynose, Sam Adams, and Harpoon. I'm telling you, these guys chase status.


Night Shift makes a couple of sours.

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:43 pm 
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I read they're focusing on sours this year. Bloor I will send you one if I can find it.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:15 am 
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Russian River and Cascade are the bar-setters for sours in the US while New Belgium makes some really decent ones as well. The Bruery makes them, just not well. I personally like Upland's lambics that they release once/twice via email orders/brewery pick-up a year. Otherwise, it's still Cantillon's and Drie's game to lose.


Last edited by Odds Bodkins on Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:40 pm 
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for what it's worth, I almost never see Sours out here (and I go to a lot of beer-heavy places, because I can't be trusted to make my own beer ya hosers). They pop up here and there, but it's rare. I feel like CA gets its hoppy reputation based largely on the San Diego breweries (i.e. Stone/Green Flash/Firestone/etc).

Around here, if I've seen an increase in anything, it's smoked lagers (smoked anything, really), black IPAs, reds, and saisons.

Granted, I still see DIPAs all over the place, but I'd imagine that's everywhere.


oh, and the beers I had the other night:
New Albion - great. It's light and crisp and a little too citric for my taste, but it's a great warm weather beer.
Flying Horse - it's a lager from India, so exactly what you'd expect there.
The Kwak and sours weren't mine, but they were also exactly as expected.

The Eagle Rare, on the other hand, was incredible. It's smooth and rich without tasting watered down or buttery. It's also $25 cheaper than Blanton's, so it might be my new jawn.

"We got beer and whiskey"
"What kind of whiskey?"
"We got both kinds; bourbon and rye"

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:18 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Cool, and this renews my thinking that sours are the new "it" thing. First it was double IPAs, then barrel aged everything, now it's wild/sour fermentation.


FWIW - I went into Five Points Bottle Shop in Athens the last time I was in town. The manager grabbed the beer guy and said to him "this is Stu, he's from Nashville and wants to know what all the cool new shit is." First thing out of FPBS guy's mouth to me was "Do you like sours?"


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:33 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
I read they're focusing on sours this year. Bloor I will send you one if I can find it.


I just got an e-mail from them today about their Sour Futures program. Seems interesting.

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:41 pm 
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discostu Wrote:
Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Cool, and this renews my thinking that sours are the new "it" thing. First it was double IPAs, then barrel aged everything, now it's wild/sour fermentation.


FWIW - I went into Five Points Bottle Shop in Athens the last time I was in town. The manager grabbed the beer guy and said to him "this is Stu, he's from Nashville and wants to know what all the cool new shit is." First thing out of FPBS guy's mouth to me was "Do you like sours?"


This stacks up with my experience as well. Sours are definitely having a moment; it's not going to be enough to register for you, Bill, because it's your favorite style of beer.

Just because you have the unreleased Sours EP and saw Sours in someone's living room while wearing a SHHHHHH getup doesn't mean the rest of the world might not dig the debut album produced by Butch Vig, yaknowwhatimean?

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:45 pm 
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Yail Bloor Wrote:
discostu Wrote:
Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Cool, and this renews my thinking that sours are the new "it" thing. First it was double IPAs, then barrel aged everything, now it's wild/sour fermentation.


FWIW - I went into Five Points Bottle Shop in Athens the last time I was in town. The manager grabbed the beer guy and said to him "this is Stu, he's from Nashville and wants to know what all the cool new shit is." First thing out of FPBS guy's mouth to me was "Do you like sours?"


This stacks up with my experience as well. Sours are definitely having a moment; it's not going to be enough to register for you, Bill, because it's your favorite style of beer.

Just because you have the unreleased Sours EP and saw Sours in someone's living room while wearing a SHHHHHH getup doesn't mean the rest of the world might not dig the debut album produced by Butch Vig, yaknowwhatimean?



laughed, hard.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:48 pm 
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REALLY hard.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:36 pm 
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discostu Wrote:
"this is Stu, he's from Nashville and wants to know what all the cool new shit is." First thing out of FPBS guy's mouth to me was "Do you like sours?"


This was awesome, by the way, and pretty much exactly what I tried (and failed) to convey. Sours are the new "it".


Also, we've had a friend over for a few days who has a newborn, so we could help her out while the husband is out of town for work for 2 weeks. Maybe my favorite beer shot yet, done with manual focus and the timer all while cooking everyone dinner...

Image

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:59 pm 
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Nice shot


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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:06 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:38 pm 
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i've also thought that sours were the next "it" beer for a good while now. they are definitely on the rise here in colorado with at least two pretty big local players focusing almost solely on the style (well i guess brett/wild beers too, but they kinda fall in with that style?):

Crooked Stave and Funkwerks

i still haven't completely warmed up to the style, but i've had a few of the more farmhouse/brett beers by both these guys and everything has been top notch.

New Belgium, Odell and Avery all seem to put out more sours each year. in fact tickets for Avery's FOURTH annual SourFest go on sale Friday. Last year sold out in minutes.

i ran across this quote which i think pretty much covers it:

Will Meyers, Brewmaster, Cambridge Brewing Company, Cambridge, Mass. Wrote:
I do foresee significant increased production of sour beers as consumers are becoming more and more interested in them. In fact, people who have previously pursued wine and cocktails are getting into craft beer more and more, as are women who (generally speaking) have a tendency to be averse to the bitterness found in most beer styles, and their interest in beer has often come via sour/wild beers. This is because the acidity and fruitiness and often tannins and oak flavors in many representatives of this category closely mimic those same familiar characteristics in wine.

While we’ll see breweries like Avery continue to lead the way in experimenting and regularly releasing barrel-aged sour beers, we’ll also see newer breweries like Crooked Stave who have an exclusive focus on the production of these beers. They are fascinating beers to brew, and more challenging than pale ales or IPAs. They take considerably longer to produce as well – months or often years per release as opposed to just three or four weeks for an IPA.

There’s more at risk when making these beers – cross-contamination, the time and money lost when a batch doesn’t turn out as expected, considerably higher labor – but this has never been a risk-averse industry to be sure. So we’ll see increased availability of these beers, but don’t expect them to supplant IPA as the country’s favorite craft beer style any time soon. Even if demand were there, we wouldn’t be able to brew enough!

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:41 pm 
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oh, i also stumbled across this website, which i lost half my day on yesterday. could pretty much be my favorite site on the internets - combining two of my favorite things...awesome beer and awesome photography.

Brew Bokeh

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 Post subject: Re: A New Nice Beer Thread
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:32 pm 
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Rick Derris Wrote:
I see nothing but the baby bjorn.


Legs dangling out...?


And speaking of you and babies, when's the announcement?

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